Jobs, marks controller and marks owner

[jayjester]

Going to quote specific passages from Section 6.2 Jobs. I won’t copy every single line, so if I miss something important, I’m sorry.

Step 1. …the player and dude starting the job are known as the leader, while the player and/or the dude (or the deed o something else) being affected by the job is known as the mark.

Step 2. First, choose one of your unbooted dudes to be the leader of the job…(explanation of requirements)
All jobs intend to do something to someplace or someone. The intended target is called the mark.
The first sentence of the job text tells you what the mark is… (where leader can be)
Once the leader’s chosen, it’s time to form posses. Just like in shootouts, the leader forms a posse
first and the dude chosen to lead the job is automatically the first person in the posse.

Step 3. Once the leader’s chosen, it’s time to form posses…(who gets to join leader’s posse)
Once the leader has declared who’s joining their posse, the mark’s controller can also form a posse. The mark can only use dudes at or adjacent to the mark’s location. Those dudes must boot to join the posse unless they are already at the mark’s location. Dudes at the same location as the mark can join even if booted. Just like in shootouts, the members of the posse are formed
sequentially and follow the same rules (see Section 6.1 above). Note that, unlike a call-out, the
mark does not necessarily have to join the posse (although it’s usually a good idea). Players
cannot form a posse containing zero dudes. If the mark’s controller chooses not to (or cannot)
form a posse, the mark’s owner, if different from the controller, can form a posse.

If the mark’s controller does form a posse, the mark’s owner cannot also form a posse. If neither the controller nor the owner choose to form a posse (this is always the case with jobs that mark the town square or the leader’s own cards), then any player, starting with the player to the left of the leader, can form a posse to oppose the job.
If no one forms a posse to oppose the job, the job automatically succeeds; skip to Step 5

1. (two player game) Opponent has a deed that I’ve taken control of. I mark the deed with a job. I control the mark, I’ve formed a posse, so the owner cannot also form a posse (to defend)? Correct?

2. I’ve succeeded at using Puppet an opponents dude, taking control of the dude. I play Ambush, making the dude my opponent owns that I took control of the leader, targeting himself. I control the mark and have formed a posse, the mark’s owner cannot also form a posse, so job succeeds, Correct?

[BeastEG]

@jayjester

1. (two player game) Opponent has a deed that I’ve taken control of. I mark the deed with a job. I control the mark, I’ve formed a posse, so the owner cannot also form a posse (to defend)? Correct?

Incorrect, this is why the last sentence of the paragraph is in there:

If the mark’s controller chooses not to (or cannot) form a posse, the mark’s owner, if different from the controller, can form a posse.

In addition, from the forming posse rules:

Players can never have dudes they control in both posses. Players cannot ever make a choice that would result in that situation, no matter what the cards say.

So the situation goes as follows:

I take control of my opponent’s Circle M Ranch, and decide I will run Establishin’ Who is In Charge, a job that marks a location I control (but do not own). Since I’m the leader, I make my posse first.

Now, the mark’s controller has first option, which would be me. However, because of the the rule where I can’t control dudes in both posses, I’m forced to pass that option, which then defaults to the mark’s owner, which is my opponent.

Therefore, the Circle M Owner does get a chance to defend their deed.

@jayjester

2. I’ve succeeded at using Puppet an opponents dude, taking control of the dude. I play Ambush, making the dude my opponent owns that I took control of the leader, targeting himself. I control the mark and have formed a posse, the mark’s owner cannot also form a posse, so job succeeds, Correct?

Incorrect as well due to the clause:

Players can never have dudes they control in both posses. Players cannot ever make a choice that would result in that situation, no matter what the cards say.

In this case, you would be attempting to control a dude in both the leader’s posse and the mark’s posse which is not possible. In addition, even if you used a different dude you control to run Ambush on the dude who you control but do not own, you get to the next clause of importance:

If the mark’s controller chooses not to (or cannot) form a posse, the mark’s owner, if different from the controller, can form a posse.

Since you legally cannot form an opposing posse because you’d then control dudes in both posses, the mark’s owner (the original player who controlled and owned the puppet-ed dude) would then get their opportunity.

EDIT: You’ll find the following line:

Players can never have dudes they control in both posses. Players cannot ever make a choice that would result in that situation, no matter what the cards say.

In the rule book on Page 20 in Section 6.1 regarding posse formation.