It’s been ruled that the 4 Auto-revolvers you have sitting at home in your Mad Scientists back pockets somehow affect an out-of-town Shootout. In other words - the Auto-Revolver does not need to be in the shootout for a player to benefit from the extra card. This was a RAW ruling that was meant to enforce rules consistency over game flavor.
It was ALSO ruled that James Ghetty cannot use the Ghost Rock from his trait to invent an Auto-Revolver as a shootout play. This is especially bizarre to me because the cards are both in the core set, are both the same value, and they specifically go together (Mad Scientist+Gadget).
I agree that a consistent rules framework is important but in this case, it comes at a pretty high flavor cost.
Auto-Revolver is a great card that’s been somewhat warped by unfun, unflavorful (though entirely logical and consistent) rulings. Since the game is ending, I think it would be great if this card would receive some errata to bring it more in line with original design intent.
If they can completely rewrite a cards text as an errata, including adding a keyword, they can fix auto-revolver. Seriously, just say that weapons, including their traits, only affect shootouts they are in.
If we go the Weapon errata route, can we also get an errata for James Ghetty so that he can use his Ghost Rock to pay for goods? Otherwise, the only things in the game it can directly be used for is Flamethrower, Bounty Hunter and Hired Help, and that’s no fun. Sure, you can pile it on Old Marge’s Manner, but surely his trait is not so strong that using it for Concealed Weapons/Auto-Revolver would be overpowered?
Is this a new ruling? I couldn’t find recent reference to it on the alderac rules forum. It does seem counterintuitive that the revolvers can be used from home, but (functionally speaking) I don’t see a problem. I also don’t think there is much precedence for flavor errata. Is there?
As for James Ghetty, he can also pay for Ornithopter and Lillian. Probably more abilities that I can’t recall off the top of my head. Not the strongest dude out there, admittedly, but I certainly don’t think an errata is in order for that reason alone. There would be no end to how many cards could be incrementally better because “they’re no fun.” We have to find fun within the structure of the game as it is.
You are right, there are a few more abilities out there he can pay for. And there isn’t really precedence or necessity for flavor errata, (except in the case of Willa Mae’s ability) I’d just like for Ghetty to be able to pay for his Auto Revolvers
The Auto-Revolver is an old ruling Since the rule book specifies that cards Abilities can be used involving a shootout they are in, or that bring a card currently in play into the shootout, but doesn’t state anything about traits, traits always work. Auto-Revolvers Trait applies so broadly, it works for every shootout you get a redraw in, anywhere. This is widely regarded as grossly out of character for a card to behave in that way, but, rules as written, that’s the way it works.
New argument is that, if they can change cards text and not just minor formatting errors, but entire functionality including adding a keyword, can we not fix a card that is clearly misbehaving to function as is sensical and intended.
James Ghetty doesn’t get to use his GR for Auto-Revolver since playing Auto-Revolver isn’t a shootout ability cost. Also of note is that he can’t use the GR abilities optional ‘costs’, since they are not an actual cost of playing the ability (Accidental reunions option of returning the card to your hand). His free GR for shootout abilities is really good for Hired Guns, Remy LaPointe, Flamethrowers.
I must say it would also tone down the strange looks from newcomers when trying to get them into the game with core-set decks and then explaining that Auto-Revolver works from anywhere because “the rules says so”
Only card i know of that works so much out-of-theme.
I also think it would be nice to be able to use James Ghetty for Concealed Weapons, but i have no idea about the balance of that, could be pretty crazy maybe…
At least there aren’t any decks (at least publicly known ones) that are unfair/broken because of the weird Auto-Revolver ruling. I’ve made attempts to break it, but the fact that it’s a gadget makes things difficult.
Still, I think it’s due for an errata. Quoteth the Jester: “weapons, including their traits, only affect shootouts they are in.” Done.
Mplain makes a good point, that “weapons, including their traits, only affect shootouts they are in” doesn’t work for cards like Tusk, Yagns, etc. I thought about adding " if they refer to a posse or shootout" at the end, but at that point we are editing the core rules to fix one single card.
Mplain has convinced me: just giving a common-sense errata to Auto-Revolver is the best approach.
Perhaps errata for James Ghetty is too much, but maybe the rules could be updated to say something like “Using Shoppin’ as a Shootout play is considered using a Shootout Ability” so that James and Lillian can pay for their Auto-Revolvers? I have to imagine the designers of the Base set intended that interaction
